View unanswered posts
View active topics
It is currently Mon May 22, 2017 6:58 pm


Author Message
liz3564
Post  Post subject: For Abish-Questions about NOM's  |  Posted: Sun May 29, 2011 8:18 am
User avatar
Priest

Joined: Wed May 11, 2011 11:13 am
Posts: 201
Location: North Carolina

Offline
Recently, Abish and I began this conversation on the Baptism thread:


liz3564 wrote:
Abish wrote:
liz3564 wrote:
Hi, Abish! NOM stands for New Order Mormon....or, in my case, probably more of a Cafeteria Mormon. LOL

Hi, liz3564. What does it mean "Cafeteria Mormon"? I mean why "cafeteria"?

liz3564 wrote:
Here is a broad definition of a NOM:
New Order Mormons are those who no longer believe some (or much) of the dogma or doctrines of the LDS Church, but who want to maintain membership for cultural, social, or even spiritual reasons. New Order Mormons recognize both good and bad in the Church, and have determined that the Church does not have to be perfect in order to remain useful. New Order Mormons seek the middle way to be Mormon.

What does it mean "middle way"? Do NOM have temple recommends? Do they pay 10% of their income? Do they accept callings? Do they accept callings as teachers of the Gospel in the Primary? Do they honestly say that they are NOM to their bishops?
Thanks for your answers.


I think that everyone is different, so I am going to speak strictly for myself.

I think what is meant by "middle way" is finding a balance within Mormonism that works for you, even if there are aspects of Church politics or doctrine that you have problems with.

I hold a temple recommend, and pay tithing.

I currently hold two callings: I am the Ward Primary Pianist and Stake Choir Director.

I have never used the term NOM to my bishop, mainly because I think of the term as more of an Internet term. It is really an acronym I discovered on various message boards, and the definition seemed to fit a lot of what I was feeling at the time.

As far as the term, Cafeteria Mormon, I use it to mean that I pick and choose the doctrine I find valuable to my life. I have a testimony of the gospel of Jesus Christ. However, there are specific aspects of Mormon history and doctrine which I am conflicted about. Polygamy is a huge issue for me. I also have a problem with a lot of the judgmentalism which tends to occur among members.

Since this thread is about baptism, and I've already "strayed from topic", let me just leave my answers at that.

I hope I have answered your questions.

I am more than happy to discuss any of these topics further with you in a new thread.

Thanks! :-)



I have gone ahead and started a new thread since she had more questions that did not pertain to the baptism OP.

Anyone who has questions regarding NOMness is free to post here.

I will state, however, that I am not answering questions in terms of ALL NOM's. My answers are based on MY INDIVIDUAL opinions.

Everyone is different. The way I approach "NOM-ness" may be different from someone else.
:-D


Top
richkelsey.org
Post  Post subject: Re: For Abish-Questions about NOM's  |  Posted: Sun May 29, 2011 10:07 am
User avatar
God of Elves, Seer Stones and a Hat

Joined: Fri Aug 21, 2009 7:57 pm
Posts: 1461
Location: Bellevue, WA

Offline
This is a bit coincidental:

I joined a NOM board earlier in the week.

And I did so partly because you Liz mentioned that you are a NOM. I almost wrote a PM asking you questions before I joined. What’s funny: now, after reading your post in this thread, some of my questions have been answered.

On a side note: Because of comments made about my site’s appearance, I held a special meeting with Global Evangelism’s design team, in which I threatened to replace the entire team with a piece of wood unless they made the site look better.

It was an empty threat, and if I had been sober I would have probably never even called the meeting. In reality a piece of wood costs money. And, in the morning I looked at the site’s home page again; I kind of like the 90s retro style, with the lame HTML tags, and the drab background.

Oh.

Back on topic: if anyone here cares to see my entrance to the NOM board here are two threads:

http://forum.newordermormon.org/viewtopic.php?t=21173
http://forum.newordermormon.org/viewtopic.php?t=21185

I’m joining another board on Monday. “Things are going to start happening to me now!” (Jimmy Hendrix)

_________________
My LDS Series:
http://www.richkelsey.org/lds_index.html
Rich Kelsey


Top
Abish
Post  Post subject: Re: For Abish-Questions about NOM's  |  Posted: Sun May 29, 2011 1:44 pm
User avatar
Stake President

Joined: Sat Apr 23, 2011 1:27 pm
Posts: 572

Offline
Thanks, Liz.
So, what I would like to know is what is the purpose to be in the Church if you don't believe doctrine? Is it only because you want to avoid uncomfortable situation?
And another question: why do you want to have temple recommend? I know that you don't keep WOW and in order to have temple recommend you have to tell your bishop about this.

_________________
THE TIME WILL COME WHEN NO MAN OR WOMAN WILL BE ABLE TO ENDURE ON BORROWED LIGHT. EACH WILL HAVE TO BE GUIDED BY THE LIGHT WITHIN HIMSELF. IF YOU DO NOT HAVE IT, HOW CAN YOU STAND?
- Heber C. Kimball, 1856


Top
liz3564
Post  Post subject: Re: For Abish-Questions about NOM's  |  Posted: Sun May 29, 2011 2:03 pm
User avatar
Priest

Joined: Wed May 11, 2011 11:13 am
Posts: 201
Location: North Carolina

Offline
Abish wrote:
Thanks, Liz.
So, what I would like to know is what is the purpose to be in the Church if you don't believe doctrine? Is it only because you want to avoid uncomfortable situation?
And another question: why do you want to have temple recommend? I know that you don't keep WOW and in order to have temple recommend you have to tell your bishop about this.

I don't think you're reading me carefully. I believe in the core doctrine of the Church, which is why I am comfortable being a member overall.

Also, where did I ever indicate that I don't keep the Word of Wisdom? I do!

And I enjoy attending the temple. It gives me a lot of peace.


Top
Abish
Post  Post subject: Re: For Abish-Questions about NOM's  |  Posted: Sun May 29, 2011 2:42 pm
User avatar
Stake President

Joined: Sat Apr 23, 2011 1:27 pm
Posts: 572

Offline
liz3564 wrote:

I don't think you're reading me carefully. I believe in the core doctrine of the Church, which is why I am comfortable being a member overall.

Then I am confused. Why do you call yourself New Order Mormon and not True Believing Mormon?

liz3564 wrote:
Also, where did I ever indicate that I don't keep the Word of Wisdom? I do!

liz3564 wrote:
I'm a Jack Mormon. I have a fondness for Starbuck's coffee. I will never own a coffee machine, but I drink it on the way to work.
I love wine, both white and red. I won't drink it with my husband, or at home, but I drink with my non-Mormon friends. A girlfriend and I are attending the NC Wine Festival the end of the month.
I come from a long line of Jack Mormons. My father, one of the best men I know, is a Jack Mormon.

I just read this post of yours.

liz3564 wrote:
And I enjoy attending the temple. It gives me a lot of peace.
[/quote]
Me, too. Lately, I am learning a lot. I met wonderful sister in my new ward. We became very good friends and every last Tuesday of the month we go together to the temple. She helped me to learn so much. Her grandfather is very well known LDS - Cleon Scousen. And her great, great, reat aunt wrote "Sisters in Zion". And before I met her I knew about Lehi dig in Jerusalem. Her father went there every year and they made excavations. Now they have big news. City that was discovered has a name - Zedek(MelchiZEDEK). Cleon Scousen was involved in this Lehi dig, too. And before I met her I read her uncles( Dr.Scousen) book "Earth in the beginning". So, I knew about her family before I met her. And when she saw me she came to me first and she invited me to her house and taught me to bake bread. She told me that she felt that she has to come to me and to know me better. And we became very, very close friends(sisters) with so much in common and with great PASSION for the Restored Gospel of JESUS CHRIST.

_________________
THE TIME WILL COME WHEN NO MAN OR WOMAN WILL BE ABLE TO ENDURE ON BORROWED LIGHT. EACH WILL HAVE TO BE GUIDED BY THE LIGHT WITHIN HIMSELF. IF YOU DO NOT HAVE IT, HOW CAN YOU STAND?
- Heber C. Kimball, 1856


Last edited by Abish on Sun May 29, 2011 4:26 pm, edited 1 time in total.


Top
Abinadi
Post  Post subject: Re: For Abish-Questions about NOM's  |  Posted: Sun May 29, 2011 4:11 pm
User avatar
MODERATOR

Joined: Thu Mar 13, 2008 12:23 am
Posts: 7869
Location: D&C 121:39

Offline
I loved W. Cleon Skousen's books when I first read them.
Even now, they are a nice template for someone wanting to do a major study on history from a mormon perspective. He also spoke and wrote (political philosophy as it related to religion) for a Unification Church organization - the "American Clergy Leadership Conference"


Top
Abish
Post  Post subject: Re: For Abish-Questions about NOM's  |  Posted: Sun May 29, 2011 4:24 pm
User avatar
Stake President

Joined: Sat Apr 23, 2011 1:27 pm
Posts: 572

Offline
Abinadi wrote:
I loved W. Cleon Skousen's books when I first read them.
Even now, they are a nice template for someone wanting to do a major study on history from a mormon perspective. He also spoke and wrote (political philosophy as it related to religion) for a Unification Church organization - the "American Clergy Leadership Conference"

She gave me one of his books "The five thousand year leap". I liked that book.

_________________
THE TIME WILL COME WHEN NO MAN OR WOMAN WILL BE ABLE TO ENDURE ON BORROWED LIGHT. EACH WILL HAVE TO BE GUIDED BY THE LIGHT WITHIN HIMSELF. IF YOU DO NOT HAVE IT, HOW CAN YOU STAND?
- Heber C. Kimball, 1856


Top
liz3564
Post  Post subject: Re: For Abish-Questions about NOM's  |  Posted: Mon May 30, 2011 8:39 am
User avatar
Priest

Joined: Wed May 11, 2011 11:13 am
Posts: 201
Location: North Carolina

Offline
Abish wrote:
liz3564 wrote:

I don't think you're reading me carefully. I believe in the core doctrine of the Church, which is why I am comfortable being a member overall.

Then I am confused. Why do you call yourself New Order Mormon and not True Believing Mormon?

liz3564 wrote:
Also, where did I ever indicate that I don't keep the Word of Wisdom? I do!

liz3564 wrote:
I'm a Jack Mormon. I have a fondness for Starbuck's coffee. I will never own a coffee machine, but I drink it on the way to work.
I love wine, both white and red. I won't drink it with my husband, or at home, but I drink with my non-Mormon friends. A girlfriend and I are attending the NC Wine Festival the end of the month.
I come from a long line of Jack Mormons. My father, one of the best men I know, is a Jack Mormon.

I just read this post of yours.

liz3564 wrote:
And I enjoy attending the temple. It gives me a lot of peace.

Abish wrote:
Me, too. Lately, I am learning a lot. I met wonderful sister in my new ward. We became very good friends and every last Tuesday of the month we go together to the temple. She helped me to learn so much. Her grandfather is very well known LDS - Cleon Scousen. And her great, great, reat aunt wrote "Sisters in Zion". And before I met her I knew about Lehi dig in Jerusalem. Her father went there every year and they made excavations. Now they have big news. City that was discovered has a name - Zedek(MelchiZEDEK). Cleon Scousen was involved in this Lehi dig, too. And before I met her I read her uncles( Dr.Scousen) book "Earth in the beginning". So, I knew about her family before I met her. And when she saw me she came to me first and she invited me to her house and taught me to bake bread. She told me that she felt that she has to come to me and to know me better. And we became very, very close friends(sisters) with so much in common and with great PASSION for the Restored Gospel of JESUS CHRIST.

I am not a TBM because, like I previously stated, I tailor portions of the gospel to what works for me. I have no problem saying "no" to a calling if it interferes too much with family. I have issues with polygamy. There are some portions of the gospel which I find difficult, or untrue, while other pieces of it...such as the core portion dealing with Christ, give me great joy.

I understand now your concern about my prior post regarding the Word of Wisdom. I had actually completely forgotten about that post. I was going through a rather rebellious period in my life at that point. I did not have a temple recommend when I posted that. I do have one now, and do not, and will not, drink coffee or wine while I am in possession of a current temple recommend. My daughter is getting married in July, and I am going through with her as her escort for her endowments. And, yes, my bishop is aware of my prior slips with the WOW. It is not an issue. He did not have a problem giving me a current TR.

I suppose what I do take issue with is some TBM's who are very judgmental. I have actually noticed this more on message boards than in real life situations. I always try to accept people for who they are. I don't think less of someone simply because they have a different religious view, or have a different lifestyle from my own. I would honestly like to see this gap bridged between members, disaffected members, and non-members.


Top
thews
Post  Post subject: Re: For Abish-Questions about NOM's  |  Posted: Mon May 30, 2011 8:59 am
User avatar
1st Presidency

Joined: Thu May 08, 2008 2:58 pm
Posts: 898

Offline
liz3564 wrote:
I am not a TBM because, like I previously stated, I tailor portions of the gospel to what works for me. I have no problem saying "no" to a calling if it interferes too much with family. I have issues with polygamy. There are some portions of the gospel which I find difficult, or untrue, while other pieces of it...such as the core portion dealing with Christ, give me great joy.

Does the "joy" received from Mormonism come at the expense of accepting the teachings of a false prophet of God?

http://www.aloha.net/~mikesch/false-prophets.htm
Quote:
Mat 7:15 Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves.
Mat 7:16 Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles?
Mat 7:17 Even so every good tree bringeth forth good fruit; but a corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit.
Mat 7:18 A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit.
Mat 7:19 Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire.
Mat 7:20 Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them.
Mat 7:21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.
Mat 7:22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
Mat 7:23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity [lawlessness].


liz3564 wrote:
I suppose what I do take issue with is some TBM's who are very judgmental. I have actually noticed this more on message boards than in real life situations. I always try to accept people for who they are. I don't think less of someone simply because they have a different religious view, or have a different lifestyle from my own. I would honestly like to see this gap bridged between members, disaffected members, and non-members.

I'll agree with the judgmental part, but regarding Mormonism, the gap will never be bridged. Most Mormons will use the tools they've been given to label the truth "anti" regarding the facts about Joseph Smith. How anyone can place faith in the occult seer stones that Joseph Smith used to supposedly "translate" the Book of Mormon defies Christian logic. To then claim Mormonism brings them closer to Christ is just a rationalization, because the facts regarding polygamy, the pagan papyrus used to "translate" the Book of Abraham, the translation of Kinderhook plates by Joseph Smith to tell of the story of Ham based on an known hoax, the prophecies that didn't come true etc., clearly dictate Joseph Smith was a false prophet of God. If one chooses to follow the false prophet knowing these things, it's a choice, but it isn't a Christian choice, it's a Mormon choice made to make life easier as following a false prophet defies Christian teaching.

http://www.aloha.net/~mikesch/false-prophets.htm
Quote:
Mat 24:11 And many false prophets shall rise, and shall deceive many.
Mat 24:12 And because iniquity [lawlessness] shall abound, the love of many shall wax cold.

2 Pet 2:1 [NIV] But there were also false prophets among the people, just as there will be false teachers among you. They will secretly introduce destructive heresies, even denying the sovereign Lord who bought them--bringing swift destruction on themselves.
2 Pet 2:2 [NIV] Many will follow their shameful ways and will bring the way of truth into disrepute.
2 Pet 2:3 [NIV] In their greed these teachers will exploit you with stories they have made up. Their condemnation has long been hanging over them, and their destruction has not been sleeping.

_________________
Tim 4:3 For the time will come when men will not put up with sound doctrine..they will gather around them a great number of teachers to say what their itching ears want to hear. They will turn their ears away from the truth and turn aside to myths.


Top
liz3564
Post  Post subject: Re: For Abish-Questions about NOM's  |  Posted: Mon May 30, 2011 9:10 am
User avatar
Priest

Joined: Wed May 11, 2011 11:13 am
Posts: 201
Location: North Carolina

Offline
Thews wrote:
If one chooses to follow the false prophet knowing these things, it's a choice, but it isn't a Christian choice, it's a Mormon choice made to make life easier as following a false prophet defies Christian teaching.


Hi, Thews! {:-D

You're one of my good buddies from MDB, and I'm really glad you're here. There is a lot of drama going on MDB with the whole Schryver mess, and you can't really have a decent discussion over there right now! LOL

How am I not making a Christian choice by worshipping Christ? When I go to Church, and take the Sacrament, I contemplate on the sacrifice Christ made on the cross. A couple of weeks ago, I sang the piece, "Jesus Was No Ordinary Man" in Church.

I understand where you are coming from as far as Joseph Smith is concerned. There are points I agree with you on. However, my take on this is, that Christ has a perfect understanding of my heart. He knows who I am worshipping, and I honestly don't think He cares whether I am paying homage to Him in a Mormon Church, a Catholic Church, a Baptist Church, etc.


Top
thews
Post  Post subject: Re: For Abish-Questions about NOM's  |  Posted: Mon May 30, 2011 10:19 am
User avatar
1st Presidency

Joined: Thu May 08, 2008 2:58 pm
Posts: 898

Offline
liz3564 wrote:
How am I not making a Christian choice by worshiping Christ? When I go to Church, and take the Sacrament, I contemplate on the sacrifice Christ made on the cross. A couple of weeks ago, I sang the piece, "Jesus Was No Ordinary Man" in Church.

I understand where you are coming from as far as Joseph Smith is concerned. There are points I agree with you on. However, my take on this is, that Christ has a perfect understanding of my heart. He knows who I am worshiping, and I honestly don't think He cares whether I am paying homage to Him in a Mormon Church, a Catholic Church, a Baptist Church, etc.

Ok... it's a choice. My point is that furthering a religion you know is false defeats the purpose. Do you believe Joseph Smith was a prophet of God?

_________________
Tim 4:3 For the time will come when men will not put up with sound doctrine..they will gather around them a great number of teachers to say what their itching ears want to hear. They will turn their ears away from the truth and turn aside to myths.


Top
Abish
Post  Post subject: Re: For Abish-Questions about NOM's  |  Posted: Mon May 30, 2011 7:41 pm
User avatar
Stake President

Joined: Sat Apr 23, 2011 1:27 pm
Posts: 572

Offline
liz3564 wrote:
I am not a TBM because, like I previously stated, I tailor portions of the gospel to what works for me.

Why? Because you believe that Jesus teaches to tailor portions of His Gospel to what works for each disciple or because it is just soemthing that you want(your will)?
liz3564 wrote:
I have no problem saying "no" to a calling if it interferes too much with family.

OK.
liz3564 wrote:
I have issues with polygamy.

Do you mean plural marriage? What kind of issues?

liz3564 wrote:
There are some portions of the gospel which I find difficult, or untrue, while other pieces of it...such as the core portion dealing with Christ, give me great joy.

Which ones?

liz3564 wrote:
I understand now your concern about my prior post regarding the Word of Wisdom.

I don't have any concerns. I only wanted to know how you could have TR in case if you drink coffee and wine. That's all. You can drink what ever you want. We all transgress the law.

liz3564 wrote:
I suppose what I do take issue with is some TBM's who are very judgmental. I have actually noticed this more on message boards than in real life situations. I always try to accept people for who they are. I don't think less of someone simply because they have a different religious view, or have a different lifestyle from my own. I would honestly like to see this gap bridged between members, disaffected members, and non-members.

I am the same way. I learned it in Church. I learned in Church not to judge others. That is THE DOCTRINE. Then comes APPLICATION. How I apply this doctrine in my life is my choice. I try to make the right one. When I do judge, I repent. I feel bad that I judged someone. I remember that I am not perfect myself.

_________________
THE TIME WILL COME WHEN NO MAN OR WOMAN WILL BE ABLE TO ENDURE ON BORROWED LIGHT. EACH WILL HAVE TO BE GUIDED BY THE LIGHT WITHIN HIMSELF. IF YOU DO NOT HAVE IT, HOW CAN YOU STAND?
- Heber C. Kimball, 1856


Top
thews
Post  Post subject: Re: For Abish-Questions about NOM's  |  Posted: Mon May 30, 2011 9:31 pm
User avatar
1st Presidency

Joined: Thu May 08, 2008 2:58 pm
Posts: 898

Offline
Abish wrote:
Do you mean plural marriage? What kind of issues?

@Abish - Would you agree that rejecting polygamy (Per the D&C 132:4) would damn the person who rejected it?

http://www.lds-mormon.com/132.shtml
Quote:
4 For behold, I reveal unto you a new and an everlasting covenant; and if ye abide not that covenant, then are ye damned; for no one can reject this covenant and be permitted to enter into my glory.


@Liz... same question.

_________________
Tim 4:3 For the time will come when men will not put up with sound doctrine..they will gather around them a great number of teachers to say what their itching ears want to hear. They will turn their ears away from the truth and turn aside to myths.


Top
Abish
Post  Post subject: Re: For Abish-Questions about NOM's  |  Posted: Mon May 30, 2011 9:44 pm
User avatar
Stake President

Joined: Sat Apr 23, 2011 1:27 pm
Posts: 572

Offline
thews wrote:
Abish wrote:
Do you mean plural marriage? What kind of issues?

@Abish - Would you agree that rejecting polygamy (Per the D&C 132:4) would damn the person who rejected it?

http://www.lds-mormon.com/132.shtml
Quote:
4 For behold, I reveal unto you a new and an everlasting covenant; and if ye abide not that covenant, then are ye damned; for no one can reject this covenant and be permitted to enter into my glory.


@Liz... same question.

I would say rejecting God's WILL would damn the person.
It doesn't matter what God commands me to do. Matter is if I reject WHATEVER God asks me to do.

Would you agree that rejecting to kill own son would damn the person who rejected it?
I wouldn't agree. But I would agree that if Abraham rejected to sacrifice/kill Isaak it would damn him.

_________________
THE TIME WILL COME WHEN NO MAN OR WOMAN WILL BE ABLE TO ENDURE ON BORROWED LIGHT. EACH WILL HAVE TO BE GUIDED BY THE LIGHT WITHIN HIMSELF. IF YOU DO NOT HAVE IT, HOW CAN YOU STAND?
- Heber C. Kimball, 1856


Top
Abinadi
Post  Post subject: Re: For Abish-Questions about NOM's  |  Posted: Tue May 31, 2011 8:46 am
User avatar
MODERATOR

Joined: Thu Mar 13, 2008 12:23 am
Posts: 7869
Location: D&C 121:39

Offline
(Abraham misunderstood.
He was never supposed to kill his son.)

_________________
"Prove it!" - Tarquinius Septem

"Everyone has to find his own path." - Ip-Man


Top
Abish
Post  Post subject: Re: For Abish-Questions about NOM's  |  Posted: Tue May 31, 2011 11:42 am
User avatar
Stake President

Joined: Sat Apr 23, 2011 1:27 pm
Posts: 572

Offline
Abinadi wrote:
(Abraham misunderstood.
He was never supposed to kill his son.)

Exactly, but he didn't know that up to the moment when angel appeared and stoped him. Abraham already sacrificed his son in his heart. If angel didn't stop him he would DO that.
So, rejecting what God is asking to do may damn person. And this can be anything. In case with plural marriage, like with many other commandments God wanted that some people do that commandment. We are all one family and we will be sealed to each other. I believe this what we will be doing during Millenium. It is all about gathering, it is all about oneness, it is all about one family, it is all about sealings to each other. This is how I understand.

_________________
THE TIME WILL COME WHEN NO MAN OR WOMAN WILL BE ABLE TO ENDURE ON BORROWED LIGHT. EACH WILL HAVE TO BE GUIDED BY THE LIGHT WITHIN HIMSELF. IF YOU DO NOT HAVE IT, HOW CAN YOU STAND?
- Heber C. Kimball, 1856


Top
Abinadi
Post  Post subject: Re: For Abish-Questions about NOM's  |  Posted: Tue May 31, 2011 2:07 pm
User avatar
MODERATOR

Joined: Thu Mar 13, 2008 12:23 am
Posts: 7869
Location: D&C 121:39

Offline
(God did not want and did not instruct Abraham to kill his son,
and God sent no angel to no body to kill no son, ever.
It's a result of myth-making. Sorry to sound so secular on this,
but that truly is my take on all these killings and murders in the Bible
- peasants dreaming big dreams, generals scheming big schemes,
and kings coveting the proverbial "more".)

_________________
"Prove it!" - Tarquinius Septem

"Everyone has to find his own path." - Ip-Man


Top
Abish
Post  Post subject: Re: For Abish-Questions about NOM's  |  Posted: Tue May 31, 2011 2:11 pm
User avatar
Stake President

Joined: Sat Apr 23, 2011 1:27 pm
Posts: 572

Offline
Abinadi wrote:
(God did not want and did not instruct Abraham to kill his son,
and God sent no angel to no body to kill no son, ever.
It's a result of myth-making. Sorry to sound so secular on this,
but that truly is my take on all these killings and murders in the Bible
- peasants dreaming big dreams, generals scheming big schemes,
and kings coveting the proverbial "more".)

Thanks for sharing your opinion. I believe that is true story. I believe that Father sacrificed His Son and He was trying to show Abraham what He will do in the future. Many stories in the Bible point to the Christ.

_________________
THE TIME WILL COME WHEN NO MAN OR WOMAN WILL BE ABLE TO ENDURE ON BORROWED LIGHT. EACH WILL HAVE TO BE GUIDED BY THE LIGHT WITHIN HIMSELF. IF YOU DO NOT HAVE IT, HOW CAN YOU STAND?
- Heber C. Kimball, 1856


Last edited by Abish on Tue May 31, 2011 2:14 pm, edited 2 times in total.


Top
Abinadi
Post  Post subject: Re: For Abish-Questions about NOM's  |  Posted: Tue May 31, 2011 2:13 pm
User avatar
MODERATOR

Joined: Thu Mar 13, 2008 12:23 am
Posts: 7869
Location: D&C 121:39

Offline
Thanks for expressing your gratitude.

_________________
"Prove it!" - Tarquinius Septem

"Everyone has to find his own path." - Ip-Man


Top
Philosoraptor88
Post  Post subject: Re: For Abish-Questions about NOM's  |  Posted: Wed Jun 01, 2011 3:14 am
Abish wrote:
Thanks for sharing your opinion. I believe that is true story. I believe that Father sacrificed His Son and He was trying to show Abraham what He will do in the future. Many stories in the Bible point to the Christ.


Why do you believe it is true? I'm just wondering what basis you have of deciphering: What is true in the Book of Mormon vs. What is NOT true in the Book of Mormon

I'd be really curious as to know what method you have of figuring out which parts are true as opposed to which are not.


Edit: Now that I think about it, I'm actually curious as to why you believe God exists in the first place. What brought you to this belief initially?

I have many reasons to show for why I do not believe that the specific christian theistic deity does not exist, but also many others, so I'm curious as to why you believe in the existence of a god, let alone the God in which you believe exists.


Top
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Print view

Who is online
Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
Jump to:   


Delete all board cookies | The team | All times are UTC - 7 hours [ DST ]

Powered by phpBB © phpBB Group.